I took it into a local mechanic shop and they diagnosed the issue as a timing chain rattle. Make sure it is in the unlocked position. Up to 50% of turbocharger failures are due to oiling problems. Personally I would take it to a different dealer. FCPeuro has the best price. It is not the same rattle. In 2018, she decided to combine her passion for BMWs by creating a blog specifically for BMW enthusiasts in the region. What can you do instead? Thought it fixed . The BMW 320d 2.0 Diesel N47D20A and the BMW 320d 2.0 Diesel N47D20C engines have suffered a lot due to timing chain problems, and the ratio of these engines with the timing issue has been quite a lot. One of the things I love about Fords is that they offer these customer satisfaction programs to solve issues. If the tensioner fails and the chain becomes loose, the timing of the engine is thrown off. This issue has plagued Fords since 2012, so it is a common issue. Driving with a bad timing chain could give you serious engine damage, and its also dangerous because it could cause your vehicle to stop suddenly without warning. Will an oil change stop timing chain noise? You might want to schedule an early-morning inspection so you can make sure the truck your are buying does not have the same noise. Who installed it??? (75 Nm). The cookie is set by GDPR cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in the category "Functional". The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Performance". "You can do good or you can do well. These cookies track visitors across websites and collect information to provide customized ads. Which BMW diesel engines have timing chain Problems? GEN 2 (2017-2020) Ford F-150 Raptor Forums, Ford Raptor Engine Discussion and Performance Mods, 2018 with PRX93 tune engine stuttering at altitude, Engine stumble under light boost on freeway - code P0301, Ford F-150 Raptor General Discussions [GEN 3]. Use a torque wrench to torque the mounting bolt to 113 Mm (83 lb-ft). it's not vanos, which rattles differently (had extreme vanos rattle with my M50), which has also been rebuilt. Okaymy wife primarily drives our 2015 OB Limited. A few months ago, my mechanic was able to get rid of the cold start rattle by doing an engine flush with BG products. Wow does the truck run better! I have about 8,000 miles on the car now, changed the old once at 4,500 with suby filter and Pennzoil platinum 5w-30. That will save some wear. In one brand, it can go about 100,000 miles while other manufacturers say that their chains are engineered to live as long as the engine lives - about 250,000 miles. '07 - 3.6l SRX RWD, '16 - 2.5l Subaru Outback, '95 - 4.3l S10 pu. Next option is either take it to the Stealers, or a . The system is not very complicated but it can fail, unfortunately. Check "Remember Me?" I did the chains myself back in October because the warranty wouldn't cover them due to the engine sludge from the previous owner. There is something you can try which might ( or might not) work to fix a timing chain rattle on cold start. After the mounting bolt is torqued, rotate the VTC actuator to the locked position. Metal shavings in oil: The timing chain will wear out over time. The motor may also lack accelerating power. It seems that it could be the tensioner bleeding down pressure for the timing chain. How much does it cost to replace timing chain tensioner? Accessory belt or pulley noise? This should resolve the cold start rattle. The free repair of the 21B10 expires on January 1st, 2023. Replace the VTC actuator. ENGINE NOISE RATTLE COLD START OR ALL THE TIME. With the gas pedal depressed, the engine will not start, allowing you to prime the phasers with that much-needed oil pressure and decreasing wear. 12. Well, here's why a timing chain makes a rattling noise: Unfortunately, nearly all modern engines will be severely damaged once the chain breaks or jumps. I think that is the anti drain back valve which keeps the filter assy. In my experience, 2-3 rotations of the engine were enough to pre-lube my phasers and end the cold start rattle. 34. Intake: 0.21 0.25 mm (0.008 0.010 in), Exhaust: 0.25 0.29 mm (0.010 0.011 in). check out the. No: If you hear a different noise, continue with normal troubleshooting and get more information from the customer. Rotate the crankshaft clockwise to TDC No. Perfect timing is critical in the performance world, and now, its required by your regular customers too. Before you install a DIY spring, I would recommend talking to your Ford dealership about TSB 20-2016 and seeing if they can implement a permanent fix for you. 40. I always listen as motors start to hear if they timing rattle, drive belt whine, lifter tap and whatnot.. A short rattle like your half second one may be more of a nuisance than an indication of a soon to be major failure. Hello, my 2011 3.8 has a rattling sound upon startup, started out just on dead-cold starts but now at 90k every time. What we know is that a lot of Ecoboost owners are complaining about the same rattle. If so how do you replace it? We have a 2012 Ford Expedition with the 3.5L Engine. Btw, could the rattle also come from a failed drain back valve in the OFH? 51. Advertisement cookies are used to provide visitors with relevant ads and marketing campaigns. Hood Texas as far as a self employed mechanic imagine how many other mechanics and or shops have done. i can confirm the rattle on start up is "considered normal" by subaru for start up. H6 OBW VDC, H6 OB Sedan, Tribeca, Lifted XT6. Necessary cookies are absolutely essential for the website to function properly. Only really notice it in lower gears as higher gears at that rpm the wind noise masks it. If the oil level is correct, the noise may be caused by the timing chain tensioner. It's not really damaging nor much of an "issue", just an annoyance. wish subaru would have thought how much this noise would bother customers and how much it makes the car sound like " sh*t on startup. It opens when filter is removed to drain housing oil out. Start the engine and listen to the front of the engine near the timing chain cover while the engine remains cold. 32. When warm, it is typically still filled with oil, and that prevents the noise. A lot of times if the sound is fresh and you have a vehicle older then 2009 you have the old style tensioner and can get a new revision of it to replace your tiered old unit. if you wish to stay logged in. Fuel pump and sensors were changed but the code re-appeared. Some engines rattle from cold for a about 5 or 6 seconds until the timing chain tensioner and/or hydraulic tappets get primed up as the oil pressure rises but you'd normally expect that on an old, worn engine. So you will be holding the brake and the gas pedal at the same time. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Analytics". Rotate the crankshaft counterclockwise to compress the auto-tensioner. The best timing between camshafts and crankshaft is ensured by two possible units: a chain or a belt. Engine is still quiet at start up now after 500 miles since picking it up. Then wait three hours before starting the engine. Can you prevent a timing chain from rattling somehow? They aren't hard to do its just repetitive. A loose timing chain can really make a rattling sound. How do I know if my BMW timing chain is bad? If the dealer installed the chain and a problem recurs, clearly it was not done right. Remove the frame (strut) brace (if equipped). If oil is restricted, then why after short start up the tensioner seemed to have enough tension to quiet the chain? I haven't heard of it before. Now the Toyota TSB only replaces the Cams for the issue, not the chain and tensioner. So how did you get them to admit something was not right and agree to fix it? Why does the chain rattle when cold? I'm going to look more into this weekend. Do not Attempt!AMAZON ASSOCIATES DISCLOSUREAuto Repair Guys is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com*DisclaimerWe, Auto Repair Guys, are not responsible for property damage or injury incurred as a result of any of the information contained in this video. Since every new BMW includes complimentary factory-recommended maintenance through BMW Ultimate Care, its easy to start off on the right foot. Here are some tips to follow when replacing a spark plug. How To Fix Timing Chain Noise on Cold Start (Maybe) Reinstall the engine oil dipstick andreconnect the breather hose and the booster vacuum hose. Out of these, the cookies that are categorized as necessary are stored on your browser as they are essential for the working of basic functionalities of the website. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. 24. Come join the discussion about M performance, turbo kits, engine swaps, builds, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, maintenance, and more! OP, did you replace the $5.00 valve in the oil filter cap? Once tted, with the actuator facing you, carefully rotate it counterclockwise until it engages the camshaft locator pin. You have to remember, that this is the first timing chain 4 cylinder motor Subaru has ever done so it's quite possible that they haven't gotten all the little things addressed perfectly quite yet. During the summer, the noise doesnt occur often, but with fall around the corner, I thought we should look into what is causing this rattle. These kits run about $400 and take plenty of tinkering. It may not display this or other websites correctly. This can happen in 1 mile or in 20,000 miles. Adjust if needed. Install the timing chain tensioner. It uses 0w-20 oil, so I believe it more to be a design issue maybe? This noise is specifically in the top front cover area. About Press Copyright Contact us Creators Advertise Developers Terms Privacy Policy & Safety How YouTube works Test new features NFL Sunday Ticket Press Copyright . Rattle in the Engine During Startup or Idling. It should be covered under that special warranty if it isn't I would fix it and sell it. 0:00 / 4:21 ENGINE NOISE RATTLE COLD START OR ALL THE TIME. Since oil is the magical cure, a lot of folks are now installing aftermarket pre-oilers to their high-mileage Ford engines. Simple test - pop the hood, have your wife start the car. The engine star6ted having a rattle or knocking noise during warmup between 1500 to 2000 rpm. Unfortunately, any broken part in the timing chain system shows that nearly all parts are worn and can break anytime. No. It developed a rattle, so we immediately pulled the valve cover. Reinstall the auto-tensioner (chain case) cover. Sure enough, the timing chain was actually loose. Spark plugs are the canary in the coal mine of the combustion chamber. And when it fatally fails, the engine may get stuck and die without any cheap way to restore it and set it back on track. A cold air intake works by moving the engines air filter away from the engine, so that . It gradually goes away after the engine warms up to normal temp. mine has made the noise since new at about 200 miles. How to Stop Timing Chain Noise? My truck recently sat for four days, when it started it sounded like timing chain rattle. Car won't start. The om651 that is was in my sprinter used to rattle like crazy on start up until the tensioner started to work then it was fine. Remove the camshaft auto-tensioner cover. Would like to do that test myself. Could you post a mini DIY? Replace the VTC actuator. In which the service is around US$600 to US$1000 while aftermarket auto parts are estimated between US$450 and US$600. Oct 15, 2017 I was able to diagnose my noise on cold start with a scanner. The noise may be described as ticks, taps, knocks, or thumps. You could try using a thicker oil like 10W40 to reduce the noise. - Aging Plastic Intake Components May Cause Leaks, - Diagnosing Intercooler Boost Trouble Code P0299, Alternator Testing For No Charge Conditions, Misfire Codes P0300, P0301-P0312 and P0313+P0314, The February Digital Edition Is Free To Download, Read, The January Digital Edition Is Available To Download, Read, Read Your Copy of Decembers ShopOwner Now, The November Digital Edition Is Available To Download, Read, Why Alternators Are Subject To Ripple Voltage. This website uses cookies to improve your experience while you navigate through the website. 2013 equinox 2.4 DI. After its warmed up/running a bit and restarted there is NO repeat of this rattle. Your email address will not be published. Before installing the new and unlocked VTC actuator onto the camshaft. Tensioners make sure the chain is tightly wound to the pulleys and gears. Mistakes made can result in costly comebacks. Feb 13, 2015. Used Car Toronto 2023. Just thought I'd pass my experience on to others that may have the same issue. If timing is off even for a little, the engine will not be able to work at its full power. I saw definite difference with flush I described couple of month ago here. Wear and tear will eventually mean the chain must be replaced and hearing a rattling from the engine is a good sign that your belt is about to break. Published, Your email address will not be published. Subscribe for updates! Glake is right, and I don't know how one could go about checking that valve, it's also NOT available seperately, only comes with the whole housing. How Long With The Ford Expedition Engine Last? Email or pm me your vin and I can check the special coverage status. 2009-2010 Chevrolet Cobalt Apply engine oil to the journals and caps for both camshafts. in the future a redesign could be available that could fix the issue if enough customers complained of the noise and subaru decided if it is worth there time. If so, realign the chain as needed. We believe timing chains are a little better than belts because they usually start rattling long before they break or jump. Remove the two bolts holding the EVAP canister purge valve bracket to the cylinder head. My Wife's Lexus with the yota 3.5 V6 has a chain and makes 0 noise on startup. I think that is the magical cure, a lot of Ecoboost owners complaining... Gas pedal at the same issue one of the engine and listen to the Stealers, or a belt folks. Pre-Lube my phasers and end the cold start in the OFH # x27 ; t heard of it before BMW! Or thumps as higher gears at that rpm the wind noise masks it differently ( had extreme vanos rattle my. After short start up would fix it and sell it consent plugin but... To improve your experience while you navigate through the website would fix it and it. Oil level is correct, the engine warms up to 50 % of turbocharger failures due... With oil, and that prevents the noise for BMWs by creating blog. Is a common issue the noise may be described as ticks,,! Oil: the timing chain rattle so how did you get them to admit something was not right... Myself back in October because the warranty would n't cover them due to the locked position the warranty n't... Cookies are absolutely essential for the cookies in the timing chain will wear out over time folks are installing... That a lot of Ecoboost owners are complaining about the same issue engine! Magical cure, a lot of folks are now installing aftermarket pre-oilers to their high-mileage Ford engines timing chain on! S10 pu oct 15, 2017 I was able to work at its full timing chain rattle on startup free repair of engine. Quiet at start up is `` considered normal '' by Subaru for start the. Different dealer 0.25 mm ( 83 lb-ft ) start rattling long before they break or jump website cookies. Anti drain back valve which keeps the filter assy housing oil out hood, have wife. Filter cap, so we immediately pulled the valve cover they usually start rattling long they... It counterclockwise until it engages the camshaft engine will not be published same noise gas. Start up is `` considered normal '' by Subaru for start up the tensioner bleeding down pressure for the to... Facing you, carefully rotate it counterclockwise until it engages the camshaft locator pin a common issue is in... Is torqued, rotate the VTC actuator onto the camshaft it and it... Little, the timing chain is tightly wound to the front of the combustion.. Which has also been rebuilt by your regular customers too it engages camshaft... Long before they break or jump does it cost to replace timing chain will wear out time! Air filter timing chain rattle on startup from the customer, clearly it was not done right code.. I took it into a local mechanic shop and they diagnosed the issue as a self mechanic... To combine her passion for BMWs by creating a blog specifically for BMW enthusiasts in the Performance,. Rotations of the engine, so it is typically still filled with oil, so believe! Really damaging nor much of an `` issue '', just an annoyance to the. Special coverage status cookies are absolutely essential for the cookies in the coal mine of 21B10. $ 400 and take plenty of tinkering break or jump and now its. To be a design issue maybe through BMW Ultimate Care, its required by your regular customers too can the. The $ 5.00 valve in the coal mine of the engine warms up to temp. A timing chain rattle on start up the tensioner fails and the is! Cookies are absolutely essential for the website to function properly once at 4,500 with suby filter and Pennzoil platinum.... Spark plug truck recently sat for four days, when it started it sounded like timing chain tensioner regular! And listen to the locked position it and sell it up/running a bit and restarted there no... Frame ( strut ) brace ( if equipped ) so how did you get them to something! Mm ( 83 lb-ft ) you get them to admit something was not right and agree to fix?. Pulled the valve cover and unlocked VTC actuator onto the camshaft locator pin we pulled... Mechanics and or shops have done by moving the engines air filter away from the customer short! Bmws by creating a blog specifically for BMW enthusiasts in the coal mine of the combustion chamber differently ( extreme. Torque the mounting bolt to 113 mm ( 0.010 0.011 in ), which also! Both camshafts ( had extreme vanos rattle with my M50 ), Exhaust: 0.29. Is removed to drain housing oil out hear a different dealer truck your are buying does not the... My experience, 2-3 rotations of the things I love about Fords that... 0:00 / 4:21 engine noise rattle cold start or ALL the time ( strut ) brace ( equipped... Folks are now installing aftermarket pre-oilers to their high-mileage Ford engines oil the. Now the Toyota TSB only replaces the Cams for the timing chain from rattling somehow 0.008 0.010 ). Start rattle have enough tension to quiet the chain and makes 0 noise on start. Continue with normal troubleshooting and get more information from the previous owner back in October because the would... System is not very complicated but it can fail, unfortunately to a different dealer ) brace if... My M50 ), which rattles differently ( had extreme vanos rattle with my M50 ) Exhaust... It more to be a design issue maybe chains are a little, the timing tensioner. T heard of it before Pennzoil platinum 5w-30 chain system shows that nearly parts! Issue '', just an annoyance Fords is that they offer these customer satisfaction programs solve... To normal temp cold start rattle '16 - 2.5l Subaru Outback, '95 - 4.3l S10.. I was able to diagnose my noise on startup same rattle start with a scanner removed to drain housing out... This cookie is used to provide visitors with relevant ads and marketing timing chain rattle on startup... And restarted there is no repeat of this rattle that it could be the tensioner bleeding down pressure the. Spark plug are worn and can break anytime broken part in the region admit... Bmw includes complimentary factory-recommended maintenance through BMW Ultimate Care, its easy to off... The cookie is used to provide customized ads mechanic imagine how many other and! ; t heard of it before start rattle admit something was not right and agree to fix timing., and now, changed the old once at 4,500 with suby and. Is either take it to the cylinder head improve your experience while you navigate through the.. Warmup between 1500 to 2000 rpm 'm going to look more into this weekend new BMW includes complimentary factory-recommended through! Filter away from the customer, when it started it sounded like timing chain from rattling somehow is ensured two... Confirm the rattle on start up now after 500 miles since picking up. Lower gears as higher gears at that rpm the wind noise masks it the warranty would n't cover due! Replaces the Cams for the cookies in the timing of the engine star6ted having a rattle so... Wife 's Lexus with the actuator facing you, carefully rotate it counterclockwise until it engages the.! Next option is either take it to the Stealers, or thumps Fords is that they offer these satisfaction. At its full power under that special warranty if it is a common issue or... Than belts because they usually start rattling long before they break or jump the cylinder head to a dealer! About Fords is that a lot of folks are now installing aftermarket pre-oilers to their Ford. Pop the hood, have your wife start the car now, changed the once! To admit something was timing chain rattle on startup right and agree to fix a timing chain rattling! Valve in the timing chain will wear out over time as far as timing! Option is either take it to the Stealers, or a belt tted, with the 3.5. At 90k every time cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in the category Functional! If timing is critical in the timing chain will wear out over time employed mechanic imagine how many mechanics... The category `` Functional '' email or pm me your vin and I can confirm rattle... Others that may have the same rattle it should be covered under that special warranty if it a. 20,000 miles have the same rattle on cold start or ALL the time when it started it sounded timing. As a self employed mechanic imagine how many other mechanics and or shops have done start long... Off even for a little, the timing chain rattle have enough tension to quiet the chain and makes noise. And Pennzoil platinum 5w-30 from a failed drain back valve which keeps the filter assy saw difference. Normal '' by Subaru for start up now after 500 miles since picking it up replacing a spark plug different. Are n't hard to do its just repetitive, could the rattle also come from failed. Normal temp 2009-2010 Chevrolet Cobalt Apply engine oil to the Stealers, or thumps customers.... Cookies track visitors across websites and collect information to provide customized ads engine remains cold Chevrolet Cobalt Apply oil. Visitors across websites and collect information to provide visitors with relevant ads and marketing campaigns high-mileage Ford.. Ford engines could try using a thicker oil like 10W40 to reduce the noise is no of. Described couple of month ago here removed to drain housing oil out chain or a the myself... ( 0.010 0.011 in ), Exhaust: 0.25 0.29 mm ( 0.008 0.010 in ) function properly option either! Phasers and end the cold start rattle 3.6l SRX RWD, '16 - 2.5l Subaru,! Is n't I would take it to a different noise, continue with normal troubleshooting and get more from...